INTERVIEW WITH U TIN MAUNG WIN

[lurie@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

Activist confident democracy will prevail in Burma
SUNDAY POST/PERSPECTIVE/16.6.96
                                    
                                    
       Tin Maung Win, vice-president of the Democratic Alliance of
    Burma, and Member of the Presidium, National Council of the Union
    of Burma spoke to assistant editor RALPH BACHOE about the latest
                       political climate in Burma.


Q: IN the past several weeks we have seen a resurgence of the
National League for Democracy in Rangoon What does this mean?

A: First let me say that calling it a "resurgence of the NLD" is
not quite accurate. The NLD has merely adopted a more aggressive
policy in pursuit of democratic reform in Burma. We must remember
that the NLD has been very patient in waiting for the generals in
Rangoon to respond to Daw Aung San Suu Kyi's call for serious
discussions regarding the future of Burma. Over the past several
years, it has become clear to everyone that Slorc has no
intention of honouring its commitment to transfer power to the
elected civilian government.

I think that Slorc, by adopting an economic policy which richly
rewards foreign business investors and its cronies, believes it
is no longer dependent upon the citizens of Burma to remain in
power. We have seen that as more investment pours into the
country, the regime has become more repressive. Aung San Suu Kyi
and the NLD have seen this correlation between hard currency
income and oppression and have concluded that by continuing to
wait for Slorc to honour its obligations to the people is no
longer a valid assumption on which to base their planning. It is
no longer necessary to receive Slorc's blessings to restore
democracy to Burma.


Q: Are you saying that democracy can be achieved even without
Slorc s approval? It has been conventional wisdom in this
struggle that a democratic government can only come about with
the consent o the army generals

A: Yes, and it was conventional wisdom at one time that the earth
was flat. Now we know that the earth is round and we also know
that rulers cannot rule if the people do not support them.


Q: At this point, it seems that only Daw Aung San Suu Kyi is not
obeying Slorc Is that going to be enough to defeat the generals?

A: You bring up one of the problems in our struggle because Daw
Suu is such a popular person in the eyes of the Burmese people as
well as the international community for displaying such bravery
in the face of possible retaliation from the ruling junta, and
also for her intelligence and leadership qualities. The press has
often overlooked the fact that there are millions of people in
this fight for freedom.


Q: You mentioned that Daw Aung San Suu Kyi is only doing what the
people expect of her And what is that?

A: As their elected leader, the people expect her to design and
implement a strategy to bring true democracy to Burma. And she is
carrying out those responsibilities with the help of both the
people inside Burma and the international community. We accepted
her decision to wage a nonviolent struggle and to focus our
efforts on attacking the "system" rather than attacking those who
serve that system.

Daw Suu has repeatedly stated that she harbours no ill will
against the soldiers of the Burma Army. She understands that many
of them are victims of Slorc as much as the civilian population.
This was borne out by the election results in 1990 where the
votes in the military cantonment area were overwhelmingly in
favour of the NLD party.


Q: Do you think there are officers in the Burma Army who would
favour a restoration of democracy?

A: I am certain of it. There are many professional soldiers who
know that the real threat to the sovereignty of Burma is not
democracy but the absence of democracy. If Slorc should get
involved in a conflict with its neighbours today, it would be
defeated simply because it would not have the support of people.


Q: Slorc is writing a new constitution for Burma which would set
aside a certain number of positions for the Army within the
legislative and executive branches of government Why wouldn't
this be acceptable as a compromise to the democracy advocates?

A: It is unacceptable for several reasons. First, Slorc had no
authority to call for a convention to write a new constitution.
You must remember Slorc seized power by a military coup d'etat.
Therefore, it has no legitimacy from day one. Secondly, there was
a national election in May 1990 in which the people, by an
overwhelming majority elected a civilian government. If there was
to be a constitutional convention, only the NLD government has
the authority to call for one. In a democracy, the Army cannot
dictate what it will or will not do. It serves the people through
their elected representatives. To do otherwise, is an act of
mutiny _ plain and simple.


Q: Are you saying that General Khin Nyunt and other members of
Slorc are guilty of mutiny?

A: It is not my place to declare guilt or innocence. The elected
government will decide whether to press charges and it would be
the decision of the courts, after a fair trial. But let me say
this. Our people have suffered enough. We want to end this
tyranny and move forward in peace and harmony under a democratic
form of government. We have lost too much time and opportunities
already. The sooner we can get this nightmare behind us the
better it will be for all of us. Therefore, I think there are
many who would favour a form of blanket amnesty, except for the
most heinous crimes perpetrated against the ethnic population in
the border area.


Q: It was reported that the recent NLD Conference decided to
write a new constitution What is the reaction of the ethnic
nationalities and other pro-democracy groups along the border who
have also prepared constitutions?

A: Burma today has no constitution. It is being ruled by military
fait accompli. Daw Suu is correct in having the NLD prepare a
draft for a new constitution.

The pro-democracy groups along the border have already delivered
their draft constitution proposal to the NLD party. Certainly
this draft will be carefully considered as the NLD drafting
committee undertakes its responsibilities. Daw Suu is aware of
the concerns of the ethnic nationalities regarding the need for
federalism and protection against "Burmanisation" policies of the
past. She has stated that without the participation and support
of the ethnic groups there can never be peace in Burma. And she
has welcomed the support and the cooperation of the border
groups. There is no fear that Daw Suu will ignore their concerns.

I think some people may misunderstand the constitutional process.
If there is no draft document to serve as a point of departure, I
doubt if there would ever be a completed constitution. It is too
important, and every word and every sentence must be carefully
chosen. So the more care that is taken in preparing the draft
document, the more smoothly the editing process will be later.


Q: If you were asked to give some advice to the NLD Constitution
Drafting Committee, what would you tell them?

A: First, I would tell them that never in their entire lives have
they been assigned such grave responsibility. They must write a
document which insures freedom and justice for all the people of
Burma. They must also remember our past and recall how we lost
our democracy to the military dictatorship. The rights of our
people, especially the ethnic minorities problem, should be
spelled out clearly and the restrictions placed on the power of
the government must also be enumerated. From experience, we know
not to trust any government with sufficient power to enslave a
nation. Quite frankly, I think the Constitution of the United
States would be a good reference to study before writing one for
Burma.

We must also remember that any constitution must be accepted by
the people before it can go into effect. I am certain that the
NLD draft will be provided to the NCUB for comments and
recommendations.


Q: Slorc has alleged that Aung San Suu Kyi is under the influence
of foreigners. What is your reaction to this charge?

A: Daw Suu is under the influence of the NLD party and the people
of Burma. It is her idea to begin the second struggle for the
liberation of Burma. She joined hands with the people after it
was well underway. Today, she continues to respond to the will of
the people. We are very fortunate that she has decided to follow
in the foot steps of her father in fighting for a free and
independent Burma. Yes, there is a influence of ideas which are
foreign to the military dictatorship _ freedom from bondage,
freedom of expression, a government of the people, by the people
and for the people.

On the other hand, it is Slorc which is under the influence of
foreigners. Without foreign investors Slorc will collapse. So
Slorc is in a status of indentured servitude to businessmen in
Singapore, Thailand, Malaysia, Japan and the United States. Of
course, Slorc is also a client state of China. 


Q: What do you think about Lee Kwan Yew's recent comments that
Daw Aung San Suu Kyi may not be able to rule the country and
would be better off remaining a political symbol?
     
A: I am sorry to hear that a person like Mr Lee Kwan Yew would
make such a remark. What I would like to suggest is that Mr Lee
stay out of the internal affairs of Burma which is also the
professed policy of the Asean countries.

We all know that Singapore has a high business stake in
exploiting Burma. If Singapore is interested in continuing to do
business with my country, I would like to suggest that the
investors from the tiny island state bide their time until Burma
regains democracy under the guidance of Daw Suu and her party.

I admire Mr Lee for his ability to successfully impose his
authoritarian rule of the tiny island state of 3 million people,
which is the size of metropolitan Rangoon.

His comment that Daw Suu lacks the ability to run the country
smacks of dictatorial jargon. Burma hosts more intellectuals than
Singapore even before that country came into being. So what is Mr
Lee talking about? I perceive his remark strictly as one
authoritarian regime propping up another equally dictatorial one.
So I would advise Mr Lee to keep his nose out of Burmese
affairs.


Q: It has been alleged that there is a rift in the Burma Army. Is
there any truth to this rumour? 

A: Yes this is true. As I have mentioned before during one of
your previous interviews with me, there is no such thing as hard
liner or a moderate within Slorc. Everyone in the regime is
against democracy.

But on certain issues, like the present where more than 250
members of the NLD were detained to preempt the sixth anniversary
meeting of the Party at Daw Suu's residence, the Army is
definitely divided as how to react to the situation. In this case
hard liners and moderates do exist in the military.

On the recent confrontation between Daw Suu and Slorc there's
definitely a split in the school of thought within the Tatmadaw.
Those hardliners belong to the camp of Gen Maung Aye,
second-in-command of Slorc after Senior Gen Than Shwe, and such
members of the ruling elite like Lt Gen Tun Kyi, Lt Gen Kyaw Ba
and some divisional commanders. This group is determined to get
rid of Daw Suu once and for all.

But according to MI [Military Intelligence] reports it was
alleged that some unforeseen elements within the armed forces are
against this idea getting rid of Suu Kyi] who instead advocate
that a democratic rule be restored to the country or else face he
consequences, like a possible backlash from the populace.

Military intelligence chief and strongman Lt Gen Khin Nyunt is
aid to be against the idea of annihilating Suu Kyi and her party
because of possible international condemnation and retaliation in
the form like trade sanctions, especially From the US. But most
importantly, He fears a possible repeat of the 1988 bloodbath
when more than 3,000 people were gunned down by the military in
the popular democracy uprising. He was supposed to have said that
the gap between the have and have-nots have widened to such an
extent that the 1988 scenario now seems inevitable.


Q: I believe Slorc is going to outlaw the NLD in the near future.
Is there any truth to this?

A: How can an "outlaw regime" outlaw the political party which
received the mandate of the people to govern Burma merely saying
that the NLD has been outlawed does not mean anything. Closing
one's eye's to reality does not make reality go away. Slorc is
looking for a reason to justify another crackdown. Making
everything illegal will give them the excuse to act, but the
action, whatever it may be, will be illegal, immoral and will
only serve to mobilise the people to protect Daw Suu and her
party.

The recent escalation of political struggle in Burma by Daw Suu
is a reflection of her responsibilities as party leader of the
NLD and as the recognised leader of Burma.


Q: Several members of the NLD have quit the party. Why do you
think they are leaving Daw Aung San Suu Kyi and the party after
six years of oppression? Do you think more will desert the party?

A: The NLD is experiencing some desertions. And yes there will be
more. 


Q: What would you do if a regime like Slorc threatened you and
your family unless you resign? The intimidation is tremendous.

A: This is one of Slorc's many strategies to isolate the party
members. Nothing has changed since U Ne Win overthrew the elected
government of late Premier U Nu in 1962. The pattern is still the
same.


Q: With respect to the struggle for democracy in Burma, how do
you foresee the overall situation?

A: I see more difficult days ahead as Slorc, in a futile attempt
to destroy the pro-democracy movement, commit more blunders and
become irrational. I see the people throughout Burma, acting as
one, becoming more defiant against the regime and more assertive
in their quest for democracy. I think I see the international
community finally recognizing the failure of constructive
engagement as a means to curtail Slorc oppression.

I see the collapse of dictatorship. I also see a free people
under a democratic government successfully confronting the myriad
of problems left over from the legacy of an incompetent, corrupt,
and brutal regime who misruled our nation for almost 40 years.


Q: When?

A: Soon. Very soon.




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